When talking to clients about estate planning, I always ask them about the title to their homes, cottages and revenue properties. The majority of people will respond with the names of the people who are "on title". However, when I ask whether the people on title are on as joint tenants or as tenants-in-common, they usually don't know. I'm often then asked, "does it make a difference?"
The short answer is yes, it makes a difference.
When a property is held in joint tenancy, the situation is what I refer to as "the last man standing". When one joint tenant dies, the entire property belongs to the remaining, surviving joint tenant(s). Whoever is the last joint tenant to die owns the property. Only that last person can use his or her Will to give the property to someone else.
For example, let's sayy Robert, Dean and Chris are joint tenants of a house. Dean passes away. Even though Dean would like to leave his share to his wife, he can't because he's a joint tenant. Robert and Chris then own the property. Robert dies. Chris now owns the whole property. Because Chris is the only name on title now, he can leave the property to his wife and children. There is nothing for Dean or Robert's families.
Tenants-in-common is a different story. In this arrangement, each person owns a half, or third, or some other portion that belongs only to them. They can leave their share to someone in their Will or sell it (never mind the logistical problems of trying to sell one third of a house).
To adapt our example above, let's say Robert, Dean and Chris are tenants-in-common of the property and each owns and equal 1/3. When Dean passes away, he leaves his share to his wife, Deana. Now the owners are Robert, Deana and Chris. Then Robert passes away and leaves his shares to his wife, Roberta. Now the owners are Deana, Roberta and Chris. In this way, each of the individual owners retains control of his or her share.
Between a husband and wife, a title is almost always held as joint tenants. This is so that when the first spouse dies, the other one will automatically own the family home without having to go through probate. Note that this is not always done in second marriages, depending on the situation.
The subject of names on title comes up at estate planning time because the type of ownership might affect your estate plan.
Note to readers: Please don't leave comments or questions on this thread. Because this thread has more than 200 comments, I can no longer see or respond to the comments at the end. This appears to be the maximum that this blog allows. I still want to reply to your comments though, so please feel free to ask your question on another thread. Thanks! Lynne
In theory each Joint Tenant owns the whole of the property jointly with the
ReplyDeleteother owner or owners. No party has a specific share in the property while
Joint tenancy continues. This means that the Joint Tenants must have equal
interests in the property, and are entitled equally to its rents and profits. There
can be two or more Joint Tenants. Joint tenancy is usual in marriage where the spouses want to hold the property equally, and, also want the principle of survivorship to apply. It is not so common in other situations. Tenants in Common have fixed undivided shares in the property. Tenants in
Common can have unequal shares (for example, two-thirds to one and one-third to the other). They are not a definitive analysis of the subject and professional legal advice should be taken before any final decision is made.
I completely agree. My intention here is to alert readers to a potential issue or question, in the hope that they will then ask their own lawyer for advice on how the issue applies to them. Thanks for your input.
ReplyDeleteCan my partner and I switch from joint tenancy to tenants-in-common if we both agree to? Will our bank agree to this if I'm the one paying the mortgage, and can prove, with partner's admission, but am the one they consider high risk for being self-employed?
ReplyDeleteYes, if you and your partner agree, you can change the title. You will have to file some documentation at the Land Titles Office but it's not a difficult transaction. I can't comment on what the bank will do with your mortgage as there are just too many variables. I certainly urge you to call your mortgage contact at the bank and talk about this before you take any steps at the Land Titles Office so that you know all the consequences before you act.
ReplyDeleteCan someone change from joint tenants to tenants in common without informing the other joint tenants? I am referring to 3 family members that have agreed upon joint tenancy - could one of the family members change the deed to tenants in common without informing the other two?? Without consent?
ReplyDeleteNo, once the document has been registered as a joint tenancy, it can only be changed to tenancy in common by signed consent of ALL of the joint owners. This process is called severing the title. I'm attaching a link to the Land Titles Office procedure manual which will tell you more about this, and let you see what the documents look like. When you get to the page, scroll down to #2 (severing).
ReplyDeleteHere's the link:
http://www.servicealberta.gov.ab.ca/pdf/ltmanual/TEN-2.pdf
Lynne
Regarding 'severing a joint tenancy', sounds like Alberta and Ontario have different rules. In Ontario, one joint tenant owner can 'sever the joint tenancy' without the consent of the other(s) joint tenant owner(s). This is often done where a couple are splitting up and one of the spouses wants to ensure his/her share of the property is part of his/her estate rather than ending up in the other owner's hands. If there are two joint tenant owners, severing the joint tenancy will result in each one owning a 50% share as a tenant-in-commnon.
ReplyDeleteHello
ReplyDeleteI own 30 acres of property with my sibling in Calderon Canada. We are both Canadian born but reside in the U.S.
He does not want to sell. Can I sell my half without him selling his half? How can I do this?
In fact he want to add his childrens names to the property now he has 4 and I have only one child.. He says he wants to add the names in case of his death so the property goes to the children. Does this not automatically happen anyways? I already have a living trust set up here in the U.S for my daughter with the property listed is that not sufficient enough?
I am a joint tenant. We are not getting along. He is living in the property and I am working to carry it., living in my house elsewhere. Can I rent weekends out to other people while he is living in it, as I work weekends and this property is rentable and on the water.
ReplyDeleteI have put all the money into it and need money. He is no longer helping with the mortgage and maintenance fees. I am trying to recover some money to pay for same as I dont want the bank to foreclose and ruin my credit rating. He has no credit rating. I live in Ontario.
Hi. It's impossible for me to tell from your post exactly how this land is owned. The form of ownership makes all the difference in the answer to your question.
ReplyDeleteYou mentioned "my half" so I assume that you two siblings own the property as tenants-in-common as opposed to joint tenants. However, you mention at the end that you have a trust in which the property is "listed". I'm not sure if that means your half is already in the name of the trust.
This is the point at which I'd look at a title to the property to make sure that you really are tenants-in-common, because in my experience, owners talk about "my half" even when they are joint tenants and there are no halves.
If you are tenants-in-common, you can sell your half without his consent and without affecting his title to his portion. If you are joint tenants, you cannot sell.
If you are tenants-in-common, he can add whatever names he likes to his half without affecting you. If you are joint tenants, he will need your consent to add the names. If you are joint tenants, understand that he is not adding names to his half because in joint tenancy there are no halves. Each joint tenant owns the entire property with a right of survivorship over the other owners. This means that if he added 4 children, there would then be 6 equal owners of the entire property. Whoever is the last person to die out of all 6 will own the whole thing. This is why I always refer to joint tenancy as a "last man standing" arrangement.
If you are joint tenants, I'd suggest that you do not agree to any names being added until you have talked to a lawyer to understand the risks to you of doing so.
To answer your question about what happens automatically, if you are joint tenants, nothing will go to the children unless their names are on the title. If you are tenants-in-common, on your death your half would be distributed according to your Will. If the property is owned by the trust, on your death it will still be owned by the trust.
I'd suggest that you obtain a current copy of the title to the land and a copy of the trust agreement, and take them to a lawyer. You need a better understanding of your ownership of this property in order to plan your estate.
My brother and I are joint tenants of my Father's house, who is now passed away. I rent the house out and we put the money in an account where we both have to sign the cheques. Usually, I do the majority of the work to keep the house repairs up, or if a contractor needs to be hired, I do it, or if the property has to be re rented I do it. He does very little, but does not think he has to pay me for any of the work I do. Can I send him a bill? Because I know what needs to be done, if I ask him, he doesn't respond, give me the OK, Most of the time, I don't know whether he is going to refuse to pay the bills I incur to run the property. He says since it is joint tenancy, he doesn't have to pay. Then he tells me I didn't do anything. Should I take pictures?
ReplyDeleteI appreciate your posting this, as it really does show why parents should think twice before leaving a title jointly to children. It really sounds as if you and your brother are having problems that are going to lead to the end of the joint tenancy.
ReplyDeleteI wonder why you are keeping the house. Is it because it was your father's house and you don't feel it should be kept in the family? Is it that your brother (or perhaps you) don't want to sell it because of property values? Because you two own it as joint tenants, when one of you passes away, the other one is going to own the entire property by right of survivorship and there will be nothing to pass to the family of the person who passes away first.
Having said that, I don't see your question as an estate planning issue. I think you need to see a lawyer who specializes in real estate and who can give you some ideas on how to deal with current issues. It's probably a good idea to do that sooner rather than later, as obviously problems have been ongoing for some time.
Lynne
I have been reading your posts on property ownership and am perplexed as to how that might affect my own situation. I have one sister (who lives far away) and we are residuary beneficiaries of Dad's estate, which is mostly bank funds and insurance. I am the sole executrix. But he had a condo, which is jointly owned by me and him (not tenants in common). If I understand you, ownership passes to me on his death (I haven't changed the title yet as his death is recent). Thus the condo is not part of the estate for probate purposes. Is that right? We never discussed that at the time he put me on the title. I just assumed it was to simplify things when he died. Surely he didn't mean for me to have it, but to sell it and split the proceeds with my sis. If I wanted to be a mean and selfish executrix and keep the condo to myself, could my sis contest my decision?
ReplyDeleteI hope that any parents who have put their real estate in joint names with their children, or are considering doing so, are reading this thread. There is a lot of uncertainty arising from these arrangements, as you are finding out.
ReplyDeleteTo answer the first part of your question, if you own the property as joint tenants, the survivor owns the entire property when the other joint tenant dies. So yes, it will pass into your name. You have to take a death certificate to the Land Titles Office to make that happen.
No, the real estate will not be part of the estate for probate purposes.
It's the last part of your question that concerns me. It just seems so risky to dispose of your biggest asset without telling anyone your intentions, yet people do this every day. From what you've said here, your father never did tell you anything such as "one day this will be yours". He didn't leave any written instructions to that effect. All we have is a joint title, which on the face of it leaves the house to you, and a Will which asks that you and your sister be treated equally.
The fact that something was in joint names used to be the end of the argument. But over the last few years, the courts are changing how we deal with intergenerational assets such as your condo. Now it becomes essential to determine whether your father intended it to be a "true" joint tenancy with right of survival, or whether he meant it to be a tool for estate planning only.
I hope you will resist the urge to be "mean and selfish" (I know you will, or you wouldn't have phrased it that way) because I don't think your position of keeping the title for yourself is that solid. I beleive that based on recent case law your sister could contest it and have a decent shot at being successful.
One last point - before you and your sister put the house in both your names, have an honest discussion about how that is going to work. Is anyone going to live there? How are expenses to be divided up? Is it to be rented out? Who'll act as landlord? Should it be sold? If you keep it in joint names, do you realize that when one of you passes away there is nothing to leave to your children?
Best of luck,
Lynne
My husband recently severed joint tenancy on our primary residence. I understand this to mean his share goes to his estate on his death rather than to me as survivor. How does this affect my ownership of this residence? (Could I actually sell?)
ReplyDeleteMy Dad is in the hospital and will be going into a long term care home. My Mom died 8 years ago and the house, bonds and bank account are in my Dad's name. My brother lives in my Dad's house and my husband and I may move into it as well but we currently own our own house. My father wants my brother and I to inherit his assets equally when he dies. We are considering adding my brother and I onto my Dad's house as joint tenants and also adding my brother and I onto the bonds and bank account. Is this the best way tax wise to handle things to avoid probate and taxes? Will adding our names trigger any capital gains or other taxes on the house, the bonds or the bank account? Are we better to just keep everything in my Dad's name only and pay the $5/$1000 on the 1st $50,000 and $15/$1000 on everything else. The house is worth about $750,000 and the bonds and cash another $250,000. If my Dad moves into a long term care home can the house still be considered his primary residence or will capital gains be triggered at some point?
ReplyDeleteIf a joint tenancy has been severed you are now tenants in common. Theoretically you should each own half of the property. You are correct in that on his death, his share will become part of his estate and be controlled by his Will. Similarly, your portion will be controlled by your Will. Yes, you can legally sell your portion, though as a practical matter, it might not be easy to find a buyer who only wants half of a title. However, other family members might be interested. Please be cautious because I don't have all the facts here and can only comment on the legalities of severed titles in general.
ReplyDeleteIf your father's home is his principal residence, there will be no capital gains tax on its disposition, whether that disposition is brought about by selling it or by adding his children to the title. So there is no difference tax-wise in those two approaches. However, there are other considerations, as you've mentioned. Often parents to add children's names to the title to avoid paying probate fees, but if your father also has other assets, it's likely that there will have to be probate in any event. I'm not a fan of putting children's names on the parents' real estate, partly because there is such a risk to the parent of the child getting divorced or otherwise losing the property. This is also because it can be a logistic nightmare to have joint owners after your father's death, unless one plans to buy the other out.
ReplyDelete2 siblings and I bought a house together and became tennants in common. I provided the funds for a down payment, and other funds, as at the time was financially more able. One sibling experienced some financial difficulty and requested I provide her ready funds equivelant to and in exchange for her share in the said property-so I would then own 2/3rds of the property. We formalised this a few years later with my official purchase of her share for '$1'. The other sibling was unaware of this transaction at the time, however now believes that becuase she was not involved in the transaction, and did not have opportunity to agree/disagree with it, then it is not 'legal'.
ReplyDeleteI have wanted to sell the property for some time however we continue to have issue over what shares i legally own.
My father recently died and his will says that my brother and I inherit his assets equally. We are coexecutors as well. His largest asset is his house. My brother does not own a home. I own a home as joint tenants with my husband. My brother is currently living in the house and my husband and I will probably also move into it in a couple of years. We are planning to keep the house until one of us wants to sell. We have been advised by a friend who does income tax returns for a living that if we transfer the title to both my brother and myself as tenants in common that will trigger capital gains on my half interest. We have been advised that we can avoid the capital gains problem if we transfer the title to my brother's name only but also have a legal agreement signed by each of us that says the property will be sold if either of us wants to sell and that my brother will pay me half of the proceeds. Is this a good way to avoid capital gains on my portion or is there a better way? If you are not the proper expert to answer this question, what type of expert should we consult?
ReplyDeleteI hold a house in joint tenancy with my mother. She became ill and decided to change her "will". She gave a copy of the title to her lawyer and asked him to include it in her "WILL".
ReplyDeleteWas it legal for him to do this without letting me know what he was doing?
My mother has since passed away, and it has created a huge split in the family.
Can a lawyer knowingly put property held in joint tenancy into as "WILL" without notifying the other tenants on the title what he is doing? Is this legal?
ReplyDeleteIf this is the case than what is the point of joint tenancy?
Hi, please see my answer to the previous question by clicking on the link here, or pasting it into your browser: http://estatelawcanada.blogspot.com/2010/09/change-of-joint-title-causes-family.html
ReplyDeleteI'm not sure why you think this is the lawyer's responsibility; if anyone is trying to do something sneaky, it's the client who is trying to get around the joint tenancy. And of course it's legal for a lawyer to keep his or her client's transactions confidential. That's one of the cornerstones of our business. As you will note from my earlier post, it doesn't matter what you say in your Will if your property is held in joint tenancy because the Will won't touch it. A part owner of a property can only dispose of his or her share of it if it's held as tenants-in-common. I think your first step is to check the title to see whether you actually own your part as a joint tenant or as a tenant-in-common, as that will determine what the other owner can or can't do in the Will.
Hello,
ReplyDeleteMy father had co-signed as a tennant in common for my home back in 2003. The share was 99% mine and 1% his. The will did not state anything in regards to giving me the home so the estate will take over ( I'm assuming ). My father has put everything to my mother. My mother would like to give the 1% to me. Will there be any charges for this and can it be done?
Ontario
My parents added me to their property as joint tennant as agreed by my brother. Now my brother has decided he wants a say in this property and possbly to inherit a portion of the property. The will states the estate is to be split 50/50. My parents are still alive and have stated their wishes are for me to have sole right to the cottage. I am currently doing costly repairs to the property based on assumption that the property is mine and my parents only. After reading the previous articles, I find I am confused. Do I inherit this property or do I share partial ownership with my brother?
ReplyDeleteIf you have been added as a joint tenant, then the Will does not control the title to the house. As I've said in a few of my posts, joint property rules have been changed by recent court cases, so that intergenerational joint property (such as yours) can be changed by the courts. The main goal for your family, I would say, is to keep all of this away from the courts. It sounds like your parents have done what they feel best in terms of planning and letting the kids know their plans. But your brother, well, this could be a problem and the estate could end up in a legal dispute. Perhaps your parents would be willing to leave a written memo stating that the house is to be yours, and that it's not intended to be part of the 50/50 split? The big issue in the intergenerational cases is that nobody knows for sure what the parents intended. If you can get it in writing, and keep it somewhere safe, you might just be preventing a lawsuit.
ReplyDeleteLynne
Hello Ontario,
ReplyDeleteSince your Dad only took 1%, I'm assuming this was done for financing or similar reasons, and not because he wanted to own part of this house. You're right that his 1% will fall under his estate and be controlled by the Will. If your Mom is inheriting everything, the 1% will be put into her name. Certainly she can give that to you. Once she owns that 1% she can basically so as she likes with it. It's not a good idea to leave it too late so that her Will ends up dividing your 1% between you and your siblings. There will be a charge at the land titles to change the title, but it will be small, as the cost of transferring generally depends on the value of the property being transferred.
Lynne
My common law partner made a deal with his grandmother a few years ago to buy her property. My partner has been the sole one making payments on this property. Part of the deal was that his grandmother lived in the house until she dies or goes to a nursing home. At the present time she is still living there. Also, when this deal was made, my partner made his parents joint owners on the property. As a common law couple with a child, we are trying to get our affairs in order to protect our family in case one of us was to die. However, his parents are refusing to take their names off the deed at this time. They stated that their name would come off the deed once we moved into the house or when it was paid off. How can we get around this issue and make plans to protect our family at this time?
ReplyDeleteMy father transfered my grandparent's cottage from the estate where he was a Trustee into his name, my name and my sisters. We have had a "falling out" He now wants to sell the cottage and retain all sale proceeds.
ReplyDeleteDo I have any rights to a share of the proceeds?
I haven't seen the Will or have any other background information, but I'm assuming that the cottage is now in three names as joint tenants. One owner can't sell if the others refuse. And even if you all agreed to the sale, why would one owner keep the money? If you agree to this sale, get your own lawyer who acts only for you, to make sure that there is someone protecting your interests.
ReplyDeleteLynne
Hi Lynne,
ReplyDeleteThank you for your response. The Will left the cottage to my father only but he then transfered it out of the estate into his name, mine and my sisters as joint tenants.
Hi Lynne,
ReplyDeleteRe: Nov 15 Post
I took your advice and spoke to my lawyer and he indicated that since my father didn't have a separate document drawn up indicating that this property was to be held in trust I am a full owner with rights to the proceeds. He did however say my father could take this to court to have a judge decide. Do you agree with his advice?
Hi Lynne,
ReplyDeleteI have a question about a family cottage property. The property belongs to my widowed mother (78) and is her only major asset and principal residence. There are 9 siblings from a blended family and 4 use the property regularly as do their children.I am also the executor of my mother's will and I know that there will be difficulty with the dispursement of this asset when my mother passes. I am having difficulty in determining the best course of action to take now such that everyone is treated fairly. Is there a standard trust arrangement that may be made such that any siblings wishing to continue to use the property may do so if, they abide by the rules and share the operating expenses as directed by the Trustee (me)? Also, it would need to be stipulated that if the trustee decided to sell the property, then all siblings or their heirs would receive equal shares of the proceeds.
At the risk of sounding cynical, this cottage arrangement sounds like a nightmare in the making. You as executor are in a no-win situation. Certainly you could have an agreement made up, and theoretically you could even please 9 people enough to have them sign it (reality is another matter). But to me this is full of problems. Only 4 people are getting benefit of an asset being held in trust for 9 of them. Won't be long before the other 5 begin to ask for some benefit too, most likely in the form of a sale. It also won't be long before a dispute arises as to who gets to use the cabin on Canada Day or some other important day. Someone will pass away and his or her share will pass to his or her kids, adding more names to the mix. Then the property will need capital repairs such as a new roof and the fight will be on as to who should pay. A repair done to preserve a capital asset should be paid by everyone who is eventually going to own it, but it's going to be nearly impossible to get money out of those who aren't actually using the cabin. And when would this trust end? I'd hate to be in your shoes trying to run this.
ReplyDeleteHave you explored other ideas, such as selling the cottage outright, and allowing the 4 who are interested to have first crack at it? They could use their share of the sale proceeds as part of the purchase proceeds. This would pay off those who aren't interested in using the cottage, and would allow you to close off your term as executor.
Lynne
As for whether I agree with your lawyer's advice, I can only say that you are much safer relying on someone who works in your jurisdiction, who has looked at the paperwork and who has discussed this in person with you than you are relying on general information from me. I'd never second-guess someone who has way more facts than I do.
ReplyDeleteLynne
Thanks Lynne. I have been concerned about this for 10 years now and there is currently a will in place which states that the property could be sold at market value less 10% and the first right of refusal will be given to the sibling(s). If more than one sibling was to buy it then the title would need to be tennants in common. One problem with that is that some of these people will not be able to afford it. Is the 10% reduction normal or could it be reduced more? Can the major shareholder (51%) prevent another tennant from selling?
ReplyDeleteIf I were you, I'd consult an accountant about the tax effects of buying something from the estate at a discount.
ReplyDeleteI'm not in favour of several siblings owning the title to a property together. It's just a problem waiting to happen. Read some of the comments that readers have left on this blog about the issues they're having with their siblings and you'll soon see what I mean. What will one person do if the roof is leaking badly and the others won't help pay for the new roof? Pay it all and help everyone at your own expense? Let the roof leak and damage your own property? And that's just one example!
The property owners are not shareholders in the corporate sense where one can out-vote another. One tenant in common can't control what another does with his or her share of the property; it doesn't matter how big or small each person's share of the title is.
Lynne
Hi Lynne,
ReplyDeleteMy husband and I bought a house with another couple. I am joint tenants with my husband as with the other couple and we are tenants in common to the other couple. Recently the other couple (who are not married) split up and one moved out. One of them wants to buy the share of the other person. Can the other person force us to sell the house? What can we do to keep the house? We were naive and don't have any formal agreements.
Whatever arrangements your friends make for their half of the house should not affect you. They can't force you to sell, though it could be pretty inconvenient for you to own part of the property if they end up fighting over the share in court. Hope it works out.
ReplyDeleteLynne
You have a very interesting site. My friend has a tenancy in common situation in a house with her brother. He owns a 2/3 share with her owning a 1/3 share. Can she be forced to sell her interest to him or through him going to the courts to any other interested party? This is in Ontario and he apparently has filed papers to the courts to force a sale. She is willing to buy him out but he seems bent on forcing her out of ownership in the property.
ReplyDeleteHi Lynne,
ReplyDeleteI wrote a comment to you a few weeks ago pretaining to my common law partners house that his grandmother is still living in. I also stated that his parents are joint tenants on the house and we asked to have their names removed. However, they are not interested in removing their names. What protection is there for my child and myself if he were to die and his parents name are still on the house?
My father has a will and power of attorney all to us three kids.
ReplyDeleteMy parent are very elderly and ready for retirement home. They own their home and other bank assets...GIC's, pensions etc.
Will any of the assets become taxable... The tetirement home and govt.look at the their taxable income in deciding subsiding their stay. I imagine my brother be pushing to have the houseand/or assets put in the kids name for this reason. Would thei be b3e any other motives?
Great site you have here.
ReplyDeleteI own a house with a girlfriend as tenants in common(50% each). I just moved into it and she wants me to pay her rent. The house was built in the 1800's and is quite dilapitated. My husband is a carpenter and we want to fix it up before selling it (which is what she wants too). We want her to pay half of the materials on the house but she refuses. We usually charge $50/hr for my husbands services. We don't believe we should pay rent because we will do the work for free. The work is vital to selling the property at a decent price. Can she make us pay rent to live in a house I own. Can we make her pay 1/2 the costs of fixing it.
Re the house built in the 1800s: this isn't really an estate planning question. It sounds like you could use some legal advice before things get out of hand. You don't need an estate planner for the question you've asked here; you need a lawyer who specializes in residential real estate.
ReplyDeleteLynne
Re the father who has set up will and power of attorney "to all three kids". Thanks for the question. Are you sure that all of you are appointed as attorneys under the power of attorney? If so, I suggest that the three of you pool your resources to pay an estate planning lawyer to spend an hour or two with you as a group. Take your documents to the lawyer and ask for clarification on who is supposed to be doing what. Find out if the power of attorney has been brought properly into effect. Talk about what needs to be done right now for your parents. Please don't take any steps like putting the house in joint names with the kids until a) you've clarified that you have authority to do that, and b) you know what the tax and legal implications are.
ReplyDeleteLynne
As one of 5 tenants in common(sisters), can I buy the others out at fair market value and avoid capital gains taxes (for them)? I wonder, if I buy their portion for a dollar but give them each a gift of $40,000, can we beat the taxman?? This 3 1/2 acres was our family home and our parents are deceased. Everyone but me wants to sell this Ontario property. Four of the five of us reside in Ontario. The other is in the UK.
ReplyDeleteHi Lynne
ReplyDeleteMy mother transfered her condo to my sister and myself 2 years before she died. TCOM 50%. My sister moved in with my mom for her well being and my mothers about 6 months after the transfer. My mother died 2 years after the transfer. My sister continues to live in condo 3 years after my mother has died. She has changed the locks and I have no access to it. I have my own life, family and house. I do not live in the condo my mother owened. All I need to know are what are my rights? Can I enter the condo if I want? Can I sell my share? Can I move in? Can I allow my nephew to move into my share? The condo mgt seems to think I have no rights since I don't live there. Also is there a main number for the MTCC or do I have to go through the number for the building only? Sorry for all the questions.
Regards
David
My mother and I are joint on her own home.(she decided in 2005 this would be a good idea- I suggest now, NOT a good idea) It was the home where I was raised and have not lived there in 30 years. I am on only child and my father is deceased. She is now in long term care. I am Guardian of Property as granted by the courts. The house has been repaired and sold by me, the closing date is this month. I will receive no proceeds from this house selling and have a Management Plan to invest her money, and will have to follow the plan. My question is am I liable for capital gains even though i will receive no money (i:e: 1/2 the selling price)?
ReplyDeleteThis is a HUGE issue for me.
Hi. It sounds like you've educated yourself about how to be your mom's Guardian of Property and have matters under control. I'm going to answer your question about the capital gain, though I do have to qualify my answer by saying that I'm not an accountant (if any accountants read this blog post and want to chime in, feel free!). I believe that you won't be liable for any capital gain on the sale of your mom's house. You said you haven't lived there for 30 years and presumably you have a principal residence elsewhere. You've stated that all of the sale proceeds will be held in trust for your mom according to her Management Plan. As the plans and their corresponding records are filed with the court, it's a matter of official record. It appears that although your name was put on the house, the beneficial owner of the property was always your mother and that your name was put on it only for estate planning purposes. This is not to say that Canada Revenue Agency couldn't one day look into the transaction further, but with all of the proceeds in your mom's hands, it seems unlikely that the matter would go any further.
ReplyDeleteLynne
Hello Lynne,
ReplyDeleteI live in British Columbia and wanted to know if Tenants in Common and Joint tenancy have the same rules in Canada? My situation is that we own a home that is in fact Joint tenancy with my husband, myself and my father in law. Its been a year and we cannot get along with the father in law. He claims he will change the house into a Tenancy in Common on his own and therefore ours will be changed automatically. So my question to you is can he do this w/o our consent and signatures? If yes, will it affect us in terms of our mortgage? He is holding all of the homes original documents (land titles) can he do anything with these? and are we able to get a second original copy? Selling the home is not an option as of now but will be down the road(est 4 years max) What kind of legal action can he take to enforce title change if this is even possible?? Please help!
The concept of Joint Tenancy is interesting. When my father died his will stipulated that the house would be inherited 60/40 with my sister. The residue of the estate would also be split 60/40. Is the house considered to be a Joint Tenancy with my sister or is it part of the estate?
ReplyDeleteDale
Hi Dale,
ReplyDeleteThere are a couple of smaller questions within your question. If your father is able to leave the house in his will, he must own it by himself and not jointly with anyone else. Otherwise his will wouldn't touch it.
The house is part of your father's estate.
If he is specifically leaving the house to you and your sister in the proportions stated, you and she will become tenants in common on the title.
This means that you and your sister will each have a portion of the house that you can leave in your own estates if you should die while the title is held this way.
In my experience, homes held between siblings are usually a disaster, and one of you will end up buying out the other.
Lynne
Thank you Lynne.
ReplyDeleteGreat lead into my follow-up question. I would like to buy her out. We had the house appraised and have agreed upon a price. Since his death I have been paying the bills (utilities, property taxes, etc.) and have been shovelling & mowing the lawn. Her position is that since I'm keeping the house, I should bear all these costs since his death not deduct her share from the final settlement. That doesn't sound right to me.
While the house is in the name of the estate, the estate should be paying the bills. So this means both of you, as those who are inheriting the estate, should pay your respective shares until such time as the house is transferred into your name.
ReplyDeleteLynne
Hello Lynne,
ReplyDeleteI own my own house (A) (my Principal Residence) in Ontario. My friend will be buying a house (B) soon (will be his Principal Residence) and we plan to own it together. Financially, I will be contributing roughly 25% and my friend 75%. Because of the Right of Survivorship in Joint Tenancy, I think we are leaning toward Tenancy in Common. Assuming the Principal Residences don't change, when we sell the house (B) I believe I will have to pay capital gains tax on 25% but will my friend have to pay tax on his 75% share? I want to be sure that my tax situation doesn't negatively impact his.
I'd suggest you check the purely tax questions with an accountant.
ReplyDeleteLynne
Hi Lynn,
ReplyDeleteMy husband and I moved into my mother-in-laws home when her husband died 26 years ago. We have three children. One still lives in the home with us. We are low income workers and will not be able to afford to run this home when she is gone. She has a will in which she states we are to get the house.
My question is do we need to go to a lawyer to become joint tenants or tenants in common as well or is the will enough for us to avoid inheritance taxes etc. (we haven't asked to see her title yet but I'm assuming that it has her and her husbands name on it) Sorry, we're just confused.
Hi dawncruiser,
ReplyDeleteIt sounds as if the home your mother-in-law lives in is her principal residence. If it is, there will be no tax assessed for the transfer of that house to someone else on her death, and there would be no need for you to take any steps to avoid taxation.
You mentioned that her husband's name is still on the title even though he died 26 years ago. That needs to be taken care of. Otherwise, when your mother-in-law passes away, you will have to probate both her will and her husband's. While your mother-in-law is alive and has mental capacity, help her connect with a lawyer who can help her transfer the title into her name alone. If paying a lawyer isn't possible, look into it by contacting the Land Titles Office in the city nearest you. Unfortunately, working without a lawyer means that future problems can't be avoided, such as leaving the title in the father-in-law's name.
No need to apologize for asking a question. Estate law is complicated. Good for you for asking questions BEFORE you're in a crisis.
Lynne
my father & i own a house 50/50. he remarried after we owned the home. the 3 of us live in this house. she has her own home that she rents out.what will happen to the house that my father & i own if one of us dies.?we live in alberta
ReplyDeleteHi Larry,
ReplyDeleteWhat happens with the house you own with your Dad depends on two things.
One - whether the title is held jointly with right of survivorship, or whether it's held as tenants in common. In my experience, people call both arrangements "50/50". If it is held as joint tenants and one of you dies, the other continues on as owner of the whole house. If it's held as tenants in common, the half belonging to the one who died will be distributed as part of his estate. The surviving owner will continue to own his half.
Two - the will in place by the person who died. This only matters if the property was held as tenants in common. If it was held as joint owners, the will makes no difference. If you are tenants in common, make sure you have a will in place stating what is to happen to your half.
In this case, if your father dies, his wife will not have a Dower right to the property because it is partly owned by you.
Lynne
I have recently drawn up wills and powers of attorney for my brothers and sisters. I'm satisfied as to the quality of the documents except I did not use Comm/Oaths or Notary. Instead I had witnesses complete unsworn statements concerning their roles as witnesses. Could you please tell me what is the downside to unsworn wills or Powers of attorney?
ReplyDeleteHi Lynne
ReplyDeleteMy family has recently found ourselves in a sticky situation. My sister was put on a family friends (a now 88 year old lady)house as a joint tenant 20 years ago. 3 years ago the lady gave my sister all the paperwork including the original land title from 1991 when she (my sister) was added as a joint tenant, she was told that the lady hadn't been feeling well and wanted to make sure my sister had all the papers while she was still able to give them to her. 2 weeks ago, my sister received a request in the mail from a notary asking her to remove herself from the title. The 88 year old was diagnosed with dementia approx. 2 years ago as well. She has told me that she now wishes to leave her house to the three care aides who are helping her. Is this even possible? Is it legal to leave property to caregivers? Does the dementia have any legal ramifications to her not being allowed to ask for a change now, after 20 years? My sister has consulted a lawyer and was told to do nothing, and to sign nothing. She was told that the lady could not ask due to her dementia. I have known this lady all of my life, my sister has been like the daughter that she never had. I cannot imagine how she would have decided to change her mind! I have known since i was 9 (now 36) that this house was going to my sister..who was 12 at the time! (now 39) Please help with info! thanks! We are in BC
I can certainly see why the alarm bells have rung; I believe that the change supposedly requested by your 88 year old friend would concern anyone who knows her.
ReplyDeleteI'm glad that your sister consulted a lawyer. Obviously that lawyer has the ability to give advice that I can't, since that lawyer has seen the document from the notary and has had the chance to discuss it in detail with your sister. Talking to an expert about this was the right move.
Yes it's legal to leave property to caregivers. But in this case, based on what you told me, it seems inappropriate.
The issue of dementia is key, as a person with dementia is generally not able to deal with legal documents. Having said that, dementia varies widely from person to person and I am in no position to diagnose it in your friend. I wonder, though, about the diagnosis 2 years ago. Was anyone appointed to help your friend under a power of attorney or a court-appointed trusteeship? I doubt that you want her appointing one of her caregivers under a power of attorney, as that would be a conflict of interest in almost every case.
Your story concerns me, as any story of potential elder abuse would. Please, please keep an eye on your friend and let it be known that your friend is not alone and unprotected.
Lynne
Lynne, my sister was actually on as power of attorney, a little over a year ago, one of the caregivers (the primary one) asked my sister for her copy of the document. My sister sent her a photocopy, only to be told they needed the original document...and yes, she sent it! I know...she shouldn't have. Word around town is that this caregiver does now hold her power of attorney. My sister can get a copy of the unsigned power of attorney from the notary, with his affidavit that he witnessed the signing of it.... when I asked our friend where my sisters copy was, she told me it would be in the hands of the people caring for her now. We have contacted the "right" people to look into things, and hope that things can be made right for her care. We have found out that she has not been outside of her house at all for a year and a half! Thank you for clarifying for me and so quickly! I do know now that the "right" people may be contacting the public guardian and trustee, so now we wait to see what will happen. Thank you once again!
ReplyDeleteLynne
ReplyDeleteI am a non resident of Canada that own a house in Canada. The title deed is solely on my name at present. I would like to know if i can add my wife as joint tenant? or She would automatically be an joint tenant when i pass away?
If i added my wife as joint tenant, would revenue Canada considered that as a sale and levy capital gain tax on me?
Thank you, for your attention, your answer will be highly appreciated.
Hi, thanks for your question. I'm not an accountant, so I'm not going to be able to give you a final answer on taxes for non-residents. However, I can share some general rules with you, so at least you have somewhere to start.
ReplyDeleteFirst of all, nobody is ever automatically a joint tenant. Becoming joint tenants is something that is chosen by the owners, usually at the time of purchase. If you want your wife to have the house you can leave it to her in your will, or make her a joint tenant.
It sounds like the house you're talking about is not your principal residence, therefore not eligible for the capital gains tax exemption. It's my opinion that you would be subject to capital gains tax at that point, though I recommend you check that with an accountant.
Lynne
Hi Lynne
ReplyDeleteThank you very much for your answer.
Yeah,I guess, I would be subject to capital gain tax if I add my wife name as joint tenant with right of survivorship.
Lynne
ReplyDeleteWhy is my comment does not appear immediately after i posted it?
Hi,
ReplyDeleteThat's because when I set up the page, I selected the option that all comments have to be moderated by me before showing up. That way I can keep out spammers, racists, bad language, etc. I can also make sure that people don't give too much information, because I want to protect their privacy and that of the other people involved in their question.
Lynne
Lynne
ReplyDeleteI see. Thanks.
Hi Lynne.
ReplyDeleteFive siblings including me,own undivided 1/5th interests in mineral rights to two quarter sections of land in Manitoba. In other words we are tenants in common. We understand the perils of this kind of ownership, given that legal or tax problems of one potentially become problems for all tenants. We are also interested in estate planning and are considering establishing a corporation to buy the assests so that shares can be left to kids rather than further fracturing ownership. Could you please tell me your thoughts on incorporating versus establishing a trust. Initial and maintanence costs are a concern as these mineral rights have serious royalty potential but are not yet producing any. Hope this question wasn't too long-winded! Thanks
Hi Lynne,
ReplyDeleteMy parents and another related couple are planning to buy a house in Ontario for investment purposes.
Can the title have four parties; my parents being joint tenants to their 50%
and the realtives (husband and wife) being joint tenants to their 50%,
however the two couples will be the Tenants-in-common?
Is the statement true that, if anything happens to one of the spouse, then the surviving spouse will auotmatically
own 50% of the property, and the remaining couple's 50% interest is not affected.
If in the future either couple wants to change from joint tenancy to tenants-in-common, or want to selll their share, does this affect the other couples 50% interest in the property?
Does the other couple need to be notifed of the change from joint tenancy to
tenants-in-common?
Thanks.
Hi Lynne
ReplyDeleteAnonymous said...
Can someone change from joint tenants to tenants in common without informing the other joint tenants? I am referring to 3 family members that have agreed upon joint tenancy - could one of the family members change the deed to tenants in common without informing the other two?? Without consent?
April 21, 2010 4:53 PM
What is law in BC? without consent?
Hi Lynne, I Live in Alberta, Canada and I live with a commonlaw partner. He has real estate property and is not divorced from his wife. The property is in Joint Tenants. We have a mortgage in both of our names if one passes away the debt goes to the other. If he dies before his spouse the property goes automatically to her. Is there any way I can get compensation for his share of the mortgage? He does not have any cash only yearly income from his property but when he dies, all income will go to his spouse. They have been separated for over 30 years but decided not to divorce for the inheritance of their property as they have 2 children and grandchildren. Can I not ask for 50% of the value increase from his share for the period of time (11 years presently)we are living together when he dies. I am not in his will how can I go about getting this if all his property is in Joint Tenancy.
ReplyDeleteThank you
Re: the common law partner who owns property with his legal wife
ReplyDeleteHi, thanks for your question. This is an interesting situation. If I understand your question correctly, there is a property owned by your CL and his wife, but you're paying part of the mortgage on it. That's a pretty good deal for them, not so great for you.
There are a few things to consider here. First of all, you say you are not in his will. However, you have been living with him for 11 years. According to Alberta law, you and he are adult interdependent partners (fancy name for common laws, really). For the purposes of inheriting, your claim now supersedes that of his legal wife over any property in his estate. Since he has not made a will that accords with the law, this may not be what he is planning. This of course applies to property that is NOT held jointly. If he doesn't leave you anything under his will, you have an automatic right to apply to the court for a share of (or all of) his estate.
Your question is "can I not ask". Who would you ask? As I mentioned above, you will have a priority claim over his estate, but the house isn't in his estate. This leaves you with a couple of options, but they are both lawsuits.
You could try suing his wife, assuming she survives him, for unjust enrichment (i.e. she got an unfair benefit). That's a tough one, let me tell you.
Another option would be making a claim against his estate for funds in the amount you contributed to the mortgage. This assumes that there is enough in the estate to pay it, and that there are no competing claims. There may also be an argument on whether your contribution is really the responsibility of the estate since the asset isn't in the estate (if his wife survives him).
Neither of these seems like a positive prospect to me.
If she passes away before him, that's another matter, because the jointly owned house will then be in his name only and controlled by his will.
This would be easier to deal with while both he and his ex are alive, but would require their consent. As things stand right now, you stand to lose. It would be more fair if you were added as another joint tenant, but given what you've said about the children inheriting, that seems unlikely.
Another option might be that he and she sever their title so that they are each a tenant in common. You could then be added to his half as a joint tenant just of his half. Again, this seems unlikely to meet with their approval as they are talking about the kids inheriting.
To be honest, I'm not really buying this bit about not getting divorced having anything to do with inheriting or with the children. How would divorcing interfere with that? It would just mean that the property is in one name instead of two.
Good luck with this.
Lynne
Hello I have skimmed through all these examples but have not found anything similar to my situation any info would be great here is my story : Back in 2000 my father died he left in his will a home to my mother and I ( his son). My mother and i have continued to live in this home and are considered joint tenants. I have since run out of room and bought another home taking possession in the coming weeks. I am uncertain as to the tax implications involved if there are any? Obviously we are not planning to sell Either property for a while but if we were to see a significant rise in realestate and wanted to sell the property jointly owned because it would remain her principle residence but not mine would there be capital gains on my end? would I be better to transfer property over? what should I do? any help appreciated
ReplyDeleteHi,
ReplyDeleteGlad to see you're planning this stuff in advance so that you won't get stuck with a big tax bill.
Yes, if you sell real estate that is not your principal residence, you will have to pay your share of the tax on the capital gain.
If you and your Mom want to transfer the property from the two of you to just her alone, there won't be tax on that because it's currently your principal residence.
Lynne
Hi Lynne, my two brothers and I were listed on title as "joint tenants" together with my mother when she revised the title to her Ontario summer camp nearly 20 years ago. Mom died last year. We are all US residents and citizens. What are we required to do now in Canada assuming my brothers and I keep the cottage (I hope nothing until some title activity like sale or selling to one of the brothers in the future)? And if we sell or severe the joint tenancy, are all the surviving joint tenants required to agree? Finally, what are the benefits of setting up what one attorney says is a great idea: "non-profit family retreat corporation" to better control rogue and uncooperative siblings? Rob
ReplyDeleteHi,
ReplyDeleteI am a joint owner of a cottage with my sister. We have never time shared the cottage. I would to start dividing the summer time into weeks to allow each family time alone at the cottage. My sister does not want to do this. What are my rights and what can I do to time for my family at the cottage?
Hi I live in Saskatchewan Canada In 2004 my father moved to BC and I rent his home in Sk. This home is not considered his principle residence. As he rents a condo in BC and files income tax in BC. He wants to change the title of his home over to my name. What are the legal and tax implication if any in doing this title transfer.
ReplyDeleteRe: time share with sister
ReplyDeleteRemember that with a joint ownership, the other owner has the same rights that you do. So for everything you have the right to do, your sister has the right to veto. It is yet another of the hundred reasons I keep telling parents not to put the cottage in the name of both/all the kids.
I don't think the solution you need is a legal or estate planning one. You're simply going to have to work it out. Frankly, it sounds like about time one of you bought the other one out, given that your wishes for the use of the property seem widely divergent.
Lynne
Re: SK father in BC
ReplyDeleteBefore making any moves, perhaps you should follow up on the question of whether or not the house in SK is actually your father's principal residence. You said he is renting a place in BC. Does this mean that the house in SK is the only residence he owns? Talk to a tax accountant.
If it turns out that you're correct that it's not his principal residence, he will have to pay capital gains tax when he transfers it to you, even if he "sells" it to you for $1. Again, talk to an accountant or a real estate lawyer to get advice specific to your situation.
Lynne
Re: Joint tenants to tenants-in-common in BC
ReplyDeleteYes, it's possible to change from being joint owners to tenants in common in BC. Although your question refers to taking steps "without informing" the other owner(s), I'm reading that as without asking for their consent. Eventually, they're going to know, since their name is on the title. Yes it is possible in BC without their consent. I don't know enough about your specific situation to give you any specific advice, but I'm attaching a link below to an article that you might find extremely useful.
http://www.duhaime.org/LegalResources/RealEstateTenancy/LawArticle-68/Joint-and-Common-Tenancies.aspx
Lynne
what type of title should be on the home
ReplyDelete15 yrs ago my brother and my self agreed to buy a home at the time i put 10,000 down and he put 0.00 down,i was not put on the deed or the mtg he has full ownership as we agreed to a verbal family agreement of splitting household cost's 50/50 and both would live in the home while after a few yrs one partner the deed title holder decided to move out and stop all payments. the party that stayed within the home had to pick up the extra cost's and allowed the other partie full right to move in when ever they need to aslong as they kept up with payment while living within the home and a few other verbal agreements on cost's. after 15 yr the deed title holder decides to take out the profits and by a home and repair the joint home while repairs are done no one can live within the home and then fails to allow the joint party after 15 yrs of being in the home and paying 100% of mtg and land taxes back into the home and says to bad you will get 50% of the profits once its sold. what can i do as this has caused my family hardship and being left homeless.
I have a question about about an estate. My Father and his mother(my grandmother) jointly owned a house in Edmonton (2002) and she fell ill 4 years later (2006)and had to move to an extended care residence. They then decided to sell the house (2007)and my grandmother told my dad to keep the money but to make sure there was enough for her funeral expenses and to fulfil the requirements of her will. Another 3 years later (2010)my father passed away and then my grandmother passed (2011). My mother is the executrix on the will. My uncle (my grandmothers son) is now making a claim to receive the money from the sale of the house that took place 4 years ago. Does he have a claim?
ReplyDeleteI have also skimmed the comments on this page and haven't found anything similar to the situation that we are dealing with. The circumstances are as follows:
ReplyDeleteMy parents own 92 acres of land in Alberta (as joint tenants), and the plan has always been for myself and my future husband to put a second home on the property. We have been advised that we do not have to subdivide as we can place a second residence on the property as long as it is 80+ acres (which it is), and so we were waiting until I finished university to go ahead with our plans. The problem is this: Mom developed early-onset dementia and now lives in a nursing home, and Dad has full guardianship and trusteeship over her. We have been advised that Dad can't simply put me on the title so that I can register a mortage in these circumstances, for that would effectively take Mom's greatest asset and diminish it by one-third. So our plans have come to a stand-still. Unfortunately my Dad won't be able to keep the farm without me and my fiance living there (too much on his plate between working full time to pay nursing home bills, and caring for Mom on weekends when he brings her home), and so we're wondering if there is any solution to this problem? Dad has indicated that he's even willing to take his name off the title to the land and put my name on in his place (as Mom's "share" of the asset wouldn't be dimished), but wouldn't this amount to severing the joint tenancy?
Any suggestions?
T
Another complication is when a parent is a guarantor of a mortgage and a joint tenant. A friend is executor of his dad's estate, dad guaranteed a mortgage for his daughter but was only joint tenant with her. Now the estate is liable for the mortgage if she defaults but the estate no longer has the power of being on title. So until the estate is released from being guarantor, which cannot happen until the house is either sold or re-mortgaged, the estate must hold back the sum they could be liable for, so no one is getting their share of their inheritance any time soon. A nightmare.
ReplyDeleteMy mother in law owned a cabin and in March of 2010 she put the names of her 4 sons on the title. I am assuming that they are joint tenants. She passed away in October of 2010 and in her will it says she give, device and bequeath her property at the lake to her four sons in equal share. How can that be when they are already registered owners of the property?
ReplyDeleteWe are now working on her estate and the accountants say that there is $15K of capitals gains payable on the cabin. Is this right that the total capital gains has to be paid or should it only be on 1/5 of the value. She did not sell but gifted.
Also if one of the four sons wants to sell can he force the sale. Or if they rest do not wish to buy him out do they have to and if so do they have to at fair market value or offer him something.
I know another cabin nightmare but any help would be appreciated.
thanks,
Sandie
Hello,
ReplyDeletePrior to my parents passing, my father tranferred ownership (sold for $2) the family cottage to myself and my two siblings.
I am interested in new construction on the land for my family. There is enough land for a new cottage to neighbour the existing building.
My question is: Can a tenant-in-common agreement be created which identifies ownership rights of the individuals? I would prefer a situation which outlines individual ownership of each specific building. I would like an arrangement where the three siblings remain tenants-in-common on the land, but individual, exclusive ownership is identified for each individual building.
As I said the land is large enough to support three families, but I would like to build a specific cottage I can pass on solely to my kids without the hassle and grief of it being willed to extended family members.
Thanks,
John
I know you may have touched on this situation but if you could please clarify as it's becoming a stressful time.
ReplyDeleteMy mother recently passed away and has put my 2 older sisters as executors/trustee. In her will, everything is left 2 us 4 kids, properties, money in the bank and investments etc. but doesn't itemize anything. Her wishes(not mentioned in the will) were to have the house and life insurance to be split 4 ways and all monies in the bank and investments to be split between the 2 grandchildren. Back in 2002, my father passed away, caused a family riff with the 2 older sisters and us (us being my mother, sister and myself) in 2003 my mother changed the title of the house as joint tenants between the 3 of us (sister, mother and myself) not the 2 older sisters. Now that my mother is gone, is the house legally ours? Can the 2 older sisters contest it if we decided to keep the house and not split it 4 ways? Reason being, is that we have seen some things starting to surface like it did when my dad passed and we want to be able to say back off or else we are keeping the house if it goes that far...I truly hope it doesn't, but would like to be able to have the upper hand if it does. I know what my mother wants but if it came down to it do we have a leg to stand on and use it to push back? I believe she may have wrote by hand on the back of the will years later on her current wishes in general points but does that have any legal implications? I just want to know, how hard I can push back if it starts to get ugly or do we just sit and watch it happen all over again. Truly if it does go south, I would like to say the house is ours and will not be spilt 4 ways if it gets bad enough...thats if it's even possible.
thanks for your help.
Anonymous
Hi,
ReplyDeleteFor the second time in as many days I find myself answering a question that involves someone having wishes not expressed in the will. Hopefully everyone reading this post will realize what a bad idea it is to have a will that doesn't actually say what you want. What's the point?
I'm not going to jump into the fray and give you or your siblings any ammunition for a fight, as that isn't what I do. However I am going to try to give you some answers to the estate questions you've raised.
If the house was owned in joint tenancy by three people and one died, then the house is now owned by the two surviving people. However, this is no longer as simple as it used to be. Changes to the law a couple of years ago have resulted in joint property that is inter-generational (i.e. between a parent and child, as it is in your case) is not truly a joint ownership. The law says that you and your sister are holding that property in trust for the estate.
The hand-written notes on the back of the will are interesting. Under certain circumstances they could be held to be valid, though that would be rare. The fact that it's in point form is ok. If the hand-written section is signed and dated, and is clearly understandable, it's possible that it could be held to be a hand-written codicil (amendment) to the will.
This would be decided by the judge at the time the will was sent to the court for probate.
I find it very sad that your family is gearing up for an estate fight, especially as you have already been through one. Perhaps you could consider having a mediator help all of you decide on a better way for this all to play out.
Lynne
Hi Lynne,
ReplyDeleteI have a question regarding probate? When an estate is probated does all assets fall under the probate or can some things be dealt with before hand such as banks, life insurance and investments and if something needs to be done through probate can we proceed at that time?
Regarding the above comment regarding the joint tenancy of a house, if the executrix/trustee is not a joint tenant, who is responsible for selling the house? Would it e the joint tenant or the trustee?
Hello,
ReplyDeletePrior to my parents passing, my father tranferred ownership (sold for $2) the family cottage to myself and my two siblings.
I am interested in new construction on the land for my family. There is enough land for a new cottage to neighbour the existing building.
My question is: Can a tenant-in-common agreement be created which identifies ownership rights of the individuals? I would prefer a situation which outlines individual ownership of each specific building. I would like an arrangement where the three siblings remain tenants-in-common on the land, but individual, exclusive ownership is identified for each individual building.
As I said the land is large enough to support three families, but I would like to build a specific cottage I can pass on solely to my kids without the hassle and grief of it being willed to extended family members.
Thanks,
John
Hi Lynne,
ReplyDeleteI am just about to have my (soon to be) ex-wife's name removed from the title of our house, and my name will be removed from the title of the cottage (this is an expedient and fair way of settling property division). We have a separation agreement that outlines this.
As soon as I have complete ownership of the house, my girlfriend of five years wants to then buy half the house. There is currently no mortgage on the house. I will own it outright. I have no desire to hold a mortgage, so she will be seeking to get financing for a mortgage (which will not be a problem, she has an excellent credit rating ...a high paying job and a decent down payment saved).
I have two children (ages 16 and 11) and want to ensure that my share of the house goes to them ...so I will likely be seeking to have the house owned as "tenants in common". Is this the correct approach? How do I protect myself against mortgage liability if she has a mortgage and my half is mortgage free? Advice would be welcome. Many thanks.
Hi Lynne,
ReplyDeleteI am in a common law relationship with a man who has two children. I have one child. We own a home together as tennants in common. Would my daughter receive half of the house while his daughters split the other half if both partners were to die? what would happen with regard to my portion of the house should I die? How will my common law partner be expected to provide my child's inheritance to her?
Hi Lynne
ReplyDeleteI live in B.C. and am thinking of buying a residential rental property with my investments if I put my wife on title as a joint tenancy could she decide in the future to make this a tenants in common with out my consent which could leave me in a situation of not totally owning this property if she were to pass & have her share go to somebody else in a will
My father past away last year 2010. In 2005 my mom and dad took out a mortgage on their condo. My mom thought this money was to be a cushion for them (they where in their early 80's). They where not qualified to get mortgage insurance due to their age. We have found out that my dad paid off all of his debt with this money (in 2005) and without the consent of my mom. With my dad passing the income for my mom has now been cut in half. Is my mom responsible for the full debt of this mortgage? There are both signatures on the mortgage.
ReplyDeleteMy wife is listed as a tenant in common on the title of her Fathers house. Her sister is listed in a copy of the will, the house is left to her. If I've read this right my wife keeps her 50% of the house and her sister gets 50% of the house, they can do what they wish with the house thereafter?
ReplyDeleteHi Concerned,
ReplyDeleteYes, you're right. Your dad-in-law can only give away what he owns, and if they are tenants-in-common he only has half to give away. As for doing what they wish afterwards, well, that's the theory as each can legally dispose of her half as she sees fit, but in reality it's usually a nightmare. It's not easy to sell half a house.
Lynne
Hi Lynne
ReplyDeleteBack in 1994, My wife and I bought a 4 cottage property in Manitoba with my sister and her two sons. We each took one of the cottages and each received a document with 1/4 Title from the municipality.
Since then, My wife and I have been divorced and I took ownership of the Cottage and she took the house. I am now the only person on the 1/4 Title.
Since the divorce, I live in the cottage as my home. I'm tired of the 4hour daily return commute, and want to sell my Cottage and 1/4 property. The three other cottages have remained relatively the same, where I have completely rebuilt a new "home" and the value has increased substantially.
My few questions are:
1: Can I sell this 1/4 Title and the Cottage? (I assume I can, My wife sort of sold her share to me when we settled the separation agreement and she was removed from the title)
2: If my Sister and my two nephews don't want to purchase it because its worth more than they are likely able to pay, (fair market value or slightly less) can I sell it to a non family member? The general public?
Thank you Lynne
Charlie
Hi Charlie,
ReplyDeleteWithout seeing a copy of the title, I couldn't say for sure, but it sounds as if your title is tenant-in-common as opposed to joint owner with right of survivorship. If that is the case, and if there is no WRITTEN side agreement about what you agreed to do with the property, then yes you can sell to whoever you want. It would be nice of you to offer it to your sister and nephews though. PS now that you are divorced - update your will!
Lynne
Hi Lynne,
ReplyDeleteI've read thru the other posting but haven't seen a situation like mine. My boyfriend and I are buying a house. The mortgage will be in his name only as he makes more and there is no need to add my income to it. We will be sharing all expenses equally and the house belongs to both of us. We sent the title in to be registered in both names. However because his name is on the mtg, the title can only be registered in his name. He thinks it's great for me becasue I'm not legally obligated on the mtg, however I'm concerend about down the road if something happens to him (death). Where does that leave me as far as owning the home?? And what are my rights over is parents and siblings as far as that goes. They won't fight for it, but I want to be smart about this before I plunge into anything without thinking. Can you please advise? Your help with this would be greatly appreciated.
Hi Lynne
ReplyDeleteThanx for responding back to me (Charlie).
You are probably right, being a tenant in common. I'm not sure to be exact, it says "Charles Last Name" is registered owner of an undivided 1/4 interest subject to such entries recorded hereon in the following described land: and then it lists the lot and block etc..
I had a realistate agent look at the property yesterday, and today they called and said that they had a client with a simular situation a few years ago and they had tentatively sold the property, but the buyers lawyer talked them out of it because of "joint ownership" liablitly issues. i.e. someone slipping off of one of the person's deck, all land owners were equally responsible.
The realistate agent declined to list the property and suggested putting a co-operative agreement in place and then list it.
I just don't know how hard it would be to get my sister and her two boys to sign any kind of formal agreement. Especially knowing I would likely sell right away.
Any thoughts or suggestions Lynne?
Much appreciated.
Charlie
Hi Lynne. Great posts. Here's another one:
ReplyDeleteMy wife's parents moved out of Montreal into a condo in Toronto be be closer to their children. At the time, they being short of assets and elderly, offered the three siblings to co-own the condo by sharing the cost of purchse. The elderly parents put down $50k but only my wife came forward and guaranteed the. Mortgage . Her siblings backed away for various reasons. She arranged to loan her parents the monthly mortgage amount with the idea that this would come back through the estate as a loan on record. The parents don't want to add my wife to the deed and after reading these posts, I am not sure that it would protect her investment . The father's intention is to leave his estate to the siblings equally while signing a statement of loan with my wife at the end of each year stipulating the amount of debt to date. I see lots of pitfalls here, even if the siblings cooperate and we are seeking estate legal help with this matter on our own. Can you give us some insight into where we go with this to protect our loan and sanity within the family? Thanks jef.
Re: Boyfriend's name on the property
ReplyDeleteIf his is the only name on the property, then you and he are not buying a house. He is buying a house. You're not buying anything. However it sounds as if you will be paying for half of its operating costs.
If he dies while his name is the only one on the title, his house will fall into his estate. Hopefully he has a will leaving it to you. Otherwise, you will only get what the laws of intestacy of your province say you will get.
A couple of Canadian provinces still have dower rights which allow a married person to live in the home for life after the spouse has died, but as you are not married, even if you live in one of those provinces that right doesn't exist for you.
You're basically completely unprotected in terms of keeping your home if he passes away. I'm glad you looked into this before eveything is all signed up.
Lynne
Hi Lynne,
ReplyDeleteMy father transferred 3+ acres of lakefront property in Ontario to my sister and I(tennancy in Common). Currently there is a bunkhouse on the property and I wish to build a cottage on the land. My sister who battles alcoholism vascilates between supporting my dream of a cottage and then turning against me and saying she will not permit it. Am I entitled to build on it without her consent? Will she have any rights to my cottage if I build it and pay for it myself?
If the property is tenancy in common, I know you can go a a lawyer and get a deed for your half of the property but you have to bring the deed with you to the lawyers for the desciption and any other legal documents showing your entitlement. I know because my mother had this done.
Deletei don't know about building on it. You have to go through the town or township you are in but I sure would get a deed in your own name for your own half.
hi Atty. lynn,
ReplyDeleteI have read thru the ex but got no similar situation.
Heres the situation:
2 years ago my mother-in-law passed away..She bought a house with his brother..she owned 25%...she has 3 kids
The brother decided to sell the property..But decided to just sell 70% to us (me and the sisters son).So we did.the house is under my name
Now he still have that 25% of my mother-in-law that is to be divided to her children..after we paid him the 70% of the house he gave 2 chidren 22,000 each but didnt gave my husbands share.
By the way there is no will and my mother-in-laws husband is still alive.
We are already went to a lawyer.He called our lawyer first saying he put it on the house..then he said its a gift what he gave the sisters.
Atty..we jaz want him to give my husbands share of the inheritance.
He wants us to buy him out (he wants more money)
he is not his share with the hydro and the house tax.
I am caught in between...i do not want to sell my house i just bought it and this guy is screwing us left and right.My husband didnt think that his own ucle will be so greedy to screw his own nephew.We even paid him more that we should.My mistake was that i didnt held my ground to put everything in paper.
The house was 250,000 we bought 70%.we are suppose to give him only 175,000.but we gave 191,000 (written in the deed of sale) but we kept his hare at 30%
we paid his debts so i added that to the payment of the house.
anyways i just want to know if there is way we can get what is due to my husband and at the same time get him out of my house without selling it and giving him more money..thank you very much.
jb
Hi - There are 5 siblings on the title as joint tenants. My question is can one sibling rent out his house that is on the property without having to share the rent with the other siblings? The original farm house is rented and the rent is shared by all siblings.
ReplyDeleteIn 2009 I moved into a home with my mother and son who obtained a mortgage as I was unable to at the time due to a bankrupcy. The agreement at the time was we were to all live in the home (my mother and myself upstairs, my son downstairs with his girlfriend) Everything split in half. Upstairs /downstairs paying 1/2 mortgage, bills, etc) Less that one year later, I sold a property and had 28000 dollars. At that time my mother and I were not getting along. I advised that I was moving out and was finished with the arrangement. She insisted she couldn't afford it and I wound up paying her 24,000 towards the money she put down for the purchase (my son put in nothing) and she moved. I have stayed and continued to pay 1/2 of everything, plus make improvements to the property for which I have the bills. The mortgage has come out of my bank account since the beginning as have the bills. My son now thinks I should move out since it's his name on the title (and my mothers) with nothing. I refuse and he keeps threatening that he can get me out. What are my rights?
ReplyDeleteAre signatures required from both parties to transfer investment asset ownership from a joint tenants with rights of survivorship to a sole account?
ReplyDeleteHello,
ReplyDeleteI'm 30 years old and my father passed away when I was 13. My parents were married during this time. When my dad passed the house went to her and we have resided there since. Recently my mom was notified that her mortgage was paid off. Attached to this notice is what appears to be a summary of land title info. I noticed that the title still states his name, but I don't see hers anywhere. Is this a problem? Can we simply go down to the land titles offices and have this info updated?
Thanks,
Melissa
Hi Melissa,
ReplyDeleteI answered your question as a new blog post on October 30, 2011.
Lynne
Hi Lynne,
ReplyDeleteOur family property with two houses is jointly owned by my bachelor brother, my two sons and myself. This property has been in the our family for six generations with the seventh generation already on the horizon. One home is occupied by my brother. The other 104 year old home was renovated by my eldest son. He now lives there with his girlfriend of two years and his twelve year old son from a former relationship.
My concern is over the Homesteads Act. In the horrible event that my eldest son passes away, my daughter-in-law automatically has homestead rights and a life estate.
Under normal circumstances the Homesteads Act definitely serves it's purpose but it is unfathomable that the girlfriend, soon to be wife, COULD live out her days on OUR family property and there's nothing we can do once it happens.
My concern is how to ensure that family only will continue to enjoy and control the property.
In the event that my future daughter-in-law refuses to sign a Release of Homestead Rights, it will be too late. What legal action could I take, NOW, to prevent her from acquiring those rights. Thank you, Phoebe
Hi, my mom speak very little English as well as her ex-bf. They brought a home together as joint tendent and lived as common law from 2000 to 2007.
ReplyDeleteThe down payment was made by my grandparents on my mother side (60K). Her ex-bf claims he and my mom paid my grandparents off, but he can't proof that.
Her ex-bf moved out in 2007 and she kept the home because she had children. She went to the lawyer and the lawyer told her she can keep living there, so she did (without separation agreement).
My mom gave her ex-bf 8k when he left and they both got a car, but there were no separation agreement written, just a verbal agreement that he moved out and gave everything to her.
Now 4 years later the home is worth more money and my mom and I been paying off the mortgage. The 5 yr mortgage is about to renew and that's the time we found out we need his approval. Her ex-bf now wants half of the money.
Is there anyway around this without going to trail? If we sold the home we would get 80K, divide that and its 40K. I think it's too risky to fight in court with a verbal agreement... I don't know what to do. We don't care about the home, just the money we paid the past 4 yr when he left and he paid nothing.
Hi Lynne:
ReplyDeleteMy son purchased a house 2 1/2 years ago with his then girlfriend. Things didn't go well and she left after 5 months. He has rented rooms out and has paid 95% of the bills since then (she pays $100 per month by agreement) She wants out of the mortgage to clear her credit.None of her money went into the down payment. He has a live-in relationship with another woman and they have been approved for a mortgage by a major bank. The former girlfriend agrees to release herself from the title, but the mortgage co., MCAP, holds a closed mortgage with a 5 year term. Can the existing joint tenants "sell" to new joint tenants that include my son, one of the original joint tenants?
Hi everyone,
ReplyDeleteMany of the questions and comments I have received on this thread are really not about estate planning at all. My specialty is not in real estate transactions; it's in estate planning. I recommend that those of you with questions about mortgages, common law relationships and other real estate matters find a lawyer who specializes in personal (as opposed to commercial) real estate law.
Lynne
Hi Lynne:
ReplyDeleteMy question is how would I go about removing my mother's name from the Joint Tenants on the Fee Simple Title to our house. Would I need to go to a notary or could I do this on my own.
Live in BC. Bought a house 2008 with my husband as joint tenant. We have a friend who co-signed in order that we qualify for mortgage. We put a down payment of 20,000 and paid the mortgage for 2 years. The co-signer is not a registered owner. 2010 co-signer wants to buy her own condo but can't qualify due to our mortgage. So we agreed to put her in title. We signed a trustee agreement to transfer 1% interest to her as joint tenant so she can pay the home grant,pay the tax and the mortgage. She paid the mortgage for 1 year only. We had a verbal agreement to divide the profit fairly but problem arises. We sold our house now. How do we divide the profit? based on the land title that states that co-signer has 1% joint tenancy and us with 99% joint tenancy or based on the trustee agreement that states she is the sole owner. The land title and the trustee agreement was both made by the same lawyer on the same day.
ReplyDeleteHello Lynne;
ReplyDeleteI have several properties with my father and 2 of those properties are registered as Tenants in Common. We paid 50/50 for the houses which we rent out. If something was to happen to my father - what would happen to the 50% (his share) - what/who will decide?
2. I am thinking of changing the properties to Joint Tenancy - is this possible to do and if so approx how much does it cost and is this what you recommend?
I only have one other sibling.
Thanks in advance.
I have a question regarding if my husband's Public Trustee can make me sell my home and give him half of the profits in Saskatchewan? Also, how do I go about consolidating debt onto my mortgage and when it comes to refinancing in a year, will a Public Trustee then make me sell the house? We have both names on the title but I am the only one making the payments, paying taxes,upkeep of the home as my husband's only source of income comes from his CPP and that goes towards his stay at a long term care home.
ReplyDeletePaula M.
Hi Lynne.
ReplyDeleteAbout 5 1/2 years ago, my sister brought her boyfriend, a sometime developer/investor/architect, to live with her, her 2 sons and my mom in my mom's home. My father passed away 16 years ago and my mom didn't want to live by herself so my sister and her 2 sons moved in. Mom is now 83 years old. This guy and my sister worked on her until she decided to help him out with his "projects" & let him be joint tenant on her property. He promised her that within 5 yrs he would build her a new home on the property that would be double the value it is now, which would be a 2 million dollar home. Apparently, he and his lawyer told her that her will she had drawn up, leaving her share to her children, would be upheld in the event of her death. To this date, there has been no new home built, the old one is falling over and in the past 5 years, he has taken out and paid off 7 mortgages of a million dollars each time. The latest mortgage taken out in 2009 was for about 1/2 a million and it was a 5 yr one. I tried to tell my mom and if she passes away, he will get everything. She was ill-advised, afraid and not making sound decisions. Because I live in another country, it is difficult for me to have any impact on her decisions when my sister and he are influencing her everyday, making her think they will leave her if she doesn't do as they say. It is elder abuse and my other siblings believe that he is a Ponzi schemer as he consistently gets other investors to pay off his previous investors and has not completed any development projects in 5 yrs, lots of talk, but no action. He has however, bought himself 2 new BMWs (all in his name), a $75,000 Hawaiian time share,a boat,a trailer, Italian designer clothes, and has taken many expensive vacations. Once in a while, he'll give my mom a $100 or so to gamble at a casino or buy her a hat. He has told my mom that she needs to cut my 3 siblings out of her will as they don't visit anymore. They don't visit because of him and are so disgusted and distraught that my mom puts this guy above her own children. We are at our wits end and don't know where to turn. My younger sister contacted the RCMP fraud dept but they said that there are too many cases like this and not enough bodies to help out. I am afraid that this guy will talk her into giving him power of attorney next. Do we have any recourse? Thanks for any info you can give us. Best regards,
Hi Lynne - My sister-in-law and I have a question about Joint Tenancy in Alberta. Our husbands are brothers and they each own 40 acres as joint tenants with their parents - these 40 acres are owned separately and have the homes we live in on them. We are wondering how easy is it to get our names added as joint tenants to these properties and what the consequences are as far as Capital Gains and what may happen to our husbands parents as far as their pensions are concerned - will this sale to us cause their pensions to decrease or is there even a sale to us?
ReplyDeleteThank you,
Brenda and Donna
Hi Lynne,
ReplyDeleteThanks for doing this; it's really helpful and informative.
I own a property in Ontario as one of 5 joint tenants. My spouse is not one of the owners and therefore would not inherit any interest in the property if I predecease her. To remedy this, I want to convey my ownership to my wife and me as joint tenants and change the relationship with the other 4 owners to tenancy in common. How do I proceed? Do the other current joint tents have to be informed and/or give their consent?
Hi there, can I see the form of the tenancy from the certificate of title?
ReplyDeleteHi Lynne,
ReplyDeleteI have been recently added as joint tenant on my dads home after my mom passed away.(House total market value 360,000, my 1/2 180,000) Question: As joint tenant, if I decide to sell the house sometime later (not my principle residence) after his death for 460,000. Will capital gains implications be based on the original full market value or my original 1/2 value?
Thank you ..great blog
Hi Lynne,
ReplyDeleteMy spouse and I currently own our home as joint tenants. When we purchased the home my mom contributed to 50% of the purchase. But the lawyer did not put her on title (still kicking myself for that one). Instead my husband and I signed a letter stating the that she has the right to 50% ownership. If we divorce would this letter hold up in court.
Your insight would be greatly appreciated.
Hi my dad is very ill and wont likely be with us much longer I am afraid our problem is he owes alot in credit card debt... soley his debt .The only asset in his estate is the house he and my mom share .It is fully paid for mortgage free and her principal residence.. both names on the title.. we are afraid the credit card company can take the house as she cant make the payments on the balance owing to them ,any idea what our options may be?
ReplyDeleteHi, I answered this last question as a new blog post on Feb. 1, 2012.
ReplyDeleteLynne
Hi Lynne,
ReplyDeleteIs it possible to specify in your will that a piece of property that is in both spouse's name not be developed (remain undeveloped) after you die?
Let me know.
Thanks
My mom and dad were joint tenants in a 50% interest in a duplex and they were tenants in common with my sister and her husband who had the other 50% share. After my mom passed away, dad added my sister as joint tenant to his portion. He did this to avoid probate fees after he is gone. His intention is covered in a will whereby his full interest (50% share of duplex) is to be split between my sister and me. Is his will valid or will my sister automatically get his full 50% of the duplex and I am left with nothing?
ReplyDeleteHi my son and his wife have recently separated and my daughter has taken over her sister-in-laws share of the house. a new mortgage was taken out between my son and daughter and they n ow hold the house as tenants in common. My son now wants to sell the house and has told my daughter she has no claim on the property as she only took it over from his wife. My daughter would like to buy her brother's share of the property, would she need a deposit to do this?? Also can my son sell the property without my daughters agreement?
ReplyDeleteHi, I'm sorry if this question has been answered already, but I didn't see a similar situation in the comment thread. My Father passed away a few months ago and he and my mother (who were divorced) owned a house as tenants in common. In his will he left everything to myself and my two siblings in equal shares. My mother is currently living in the house, however cannot afford the costs associated on her own and expects us to pay "our half" of the costs. She is also not in favor of selling the house. I feel the house should just be sold so as to be done with everything, however as I only own 1/6 share, do I have any say in this? Would I need to get my siblings on my side in order to have any sway?
ReplyDeleteThanks in advance.
My spouse and I currently own our home as joint tenants. When we purchased the home my mom contributed to 50% of the purchase. But the lawyer did not put her on title (still kicking myself for that one). Instead my husband and I signed a letter stating the that she has the right to 50% ownership(in a form of a Trust Agreement). If we divorce would this letter hold up in court.
ReplyDeleteYour insight would be greatly appreciated
I personally am about to apply for a tax amnesty. I will probably owe a large sum of money in personal back taxes when things are said and done. Would it be wise to sever our joint tenancy in our house to protect my wifes half interest. thanks for ant information
ReplyDeleteHi Lynne,
ReplyDeleteI live in Ontario and we own a house as tenants in common with a friend of ours. He has recently sold his half of the house (all one deed), and another friend of ours has bought it. My question is, how is land transfer tax handled on a property like this? We are all one deed, so when the new tenants in common move in will the land transfer tax be based on what they bought him out for and something that only they pay (since we already paid ours when we moved in)? Or do we pay again to stay in our house? (which doesn't seem right!)
Hi Lynne:
ReplyDeleteThanks for your great blog. I wonder if you could share your insights on the following issue. My father and grandmother were placed on title of the family cottage that was purchased over 35 years ago. Up until recently, they had believed that the cottage was held as a joint tenancy with right of survivorship. It turns out, however, that the cottage deed lists them as tenants in common rather than joint tenants. This was unfortunately discovered after grandmother's recent passing. My question is whether it would be possible (or if there is any case law to this regard) to retrospectively declare the tenancy as one of joint tenancy, rather than tenancy in common. I ask because it seems to me that the unities that characterize joint tenancy are met in this case (ie, they purchased the cottage together, at the same time, had the same 50% interest accruing under the same conveyance, and intended the arrangement to be one of joint tenancy with ROS). Other relevant information is that they were new immigrants with limited command of the english language at the time of purchase, so that the possibility of a language barrier/misunderstanding cannot be rules out; and, grandma's will passed on her entire estate to my father as the sole beneficiary, so that the end result with regard to inheritance and benefit is essentially unchanged; notwithstanding probate taxes being payable under the tenants in common scenario. Is it too late to right this error or could something still be possible? And if so, what is the probability of success? Thanks in advance for your insights and suggestions.
Hi Lynne,
ReplyDeleteMy mother left her home in Nova Scotia to my sister and me in her will. My sister and I are joint owners not tenants in common. My mother, my sister and I are listed on the deed. Mother is now deceased and my sister wants to sell. I do not,nor do I want to buy her out.Can she force the sale of the house? We live in Massachusetts and have used the house as a vacation home.
My husband and I own our home as tenants in common, and would like to change the ownership to joint tenants.
ReplyDeleteHow do we do that, and are there tax or other consequences?
We applied for an increased home equity loan and Scotia bank uses First Canadian title. I was told by Scotiabank they can only handle changes to joint tenant titles. I originally used tenants in commom to protest my interest in the property because we were not married, but this is no longer needed
In regards to the question on changing from tenants in common to joint tenants on the ownership with my husband, my province of residence is Alberta
ReplyDeleteI am 'joint-tenants' with my ex-husband on our home. We never split this asset because he was dealing with a disorder and could not work full time, I wanted to ensure he could continue living in the house and have no pressure financially or to move. I just found out he is getting married. I am concerned that his soon to be new wife has some rights once they marry. The home is in BC and we both live in BC. Can he change the 'joint tenant' title without telling me? I want to ensure that if something happened to him...his new wife does not have right to the home. What are your suggestions to ensure I am protecting myself?
ReplyDeleteOur mother left the family home to my 3 siblings and myself. Each of us is listed "as to an undivided 1/4 interest". Can I conclude that this is "tenants in common", as the title certificate does not specifically say that? If this is correct, am I able to "give up" my share as I see fit? ie: sell to an outside party, give to another already on title, etc.? I appreciate your response.
ReplyDeleteMy mother passed away this March. She did not have a will. My father passed away 3 weeks later and he had a will. He made his will before the mother died. Therefore, his will should not cover this 50% mother's share of the property. Both of them had a property in Burnaby under joint tenancy of value approx. $600,000.- Due to short time and even probete has not been arranged, i.e. land title has not been changed. My mother was in care home since 2006. Three years ago, I was in competition to the father as mother's committee that I was being appointed as committee by the court. During the competition process, the father did declare the mother had 50% share of the property as her asset, also the father stated in his affidavit that the mother's legal address was the address of care home; also the father did try to prevent other family members to visit the mother which was a big concern of the judge. On the committee court order, it has been specifically that the committee should not touch the said property that the father and mother shared. Question: if the joint tenancy has been broken? and if the property is now 100% belong to the beneficier due to joint tenancy? Or alternatively this mother's 50% share should be equally distribute amonst her next-of-kin law?
ReplyDeleteMy brother and I have purchased a duplex and we are considered to be"joint tenants" Now I was wondering if we would be able to change to "tenants in common" providing both of us agree. If the answer is yes, would I be able to sell my half of the duplex? (Ontario)
ReplyDeletethanks
Hi Lynne,
ReplyDeleteMy wife and I are having a will done. We want joint tenancy to save on the probate hassles. I want my wife to have the house for as long as she wants. I have one daughter from a previous marriage. I want her to get a portion whenever my wife sells, which she thinks would be soon after but who knows. Can this be done by a written agreement between my wife and my daughter and should it be stated as a lump sum or as a percentage.
Hi...ty for doing this...most appreciated!
ReplyDeleteMy question is my mom assisted my common in law hubby & me get a house with the mortgage under her nane & down payment as part of my inheritance. I am listed as joint tenancy on both this property & also on my moher's home. I have now lost my mom...the plan was always 2 b to add my hubby...now there is a problem...
My hubby has an estranged daughter & I would prefer that if something happens to me first...that my hubby could remain in the house until he chooses to liquidate it, @ that time I would like my share to return to my estate. If something happens to him first he would like me to have his share. Would the best thing for us to be Tenants in Common...with hubby entering me with right of survivorship...or would we both require a will stating our wishes...I hold other assets that I will have to provide for in a will...however, he doesnt. Would this simplify everything or make it more complicated...sigh...getting confused with all the ins & outs...we reside in BC
Ty so much for some enlightenment!!!
Hi Lynne:
ReplyDeleteI own a 22% share of an Ontario farm property in which the 6 owners all have unequal shares in the farm and it is held as Tenants in Common. Some time after I purchased my share in the farm, the group purchased solar panels for this farm and all payed an equal amount to install the panels. The income from these panels is divided equally among the 6 owners. Unfortunately no solar agreement was set up when the panels were installed. I am interested in now selling my 22% share in the property. Is this share now 22% of the increased value of the farm property (ie land plus solar panels), or do I need to get the land and the solar panels appraised separately to determine my share of the total value of the farm?
My Mother, brother and his wife are tenants in common on a cottage property. My brother divorced and bought his wife's share. My Mother has just signed her share over to me. My brother now says I only own half of my Mother's 1/3 ownership when she signed it over to me. Is this correct?
ReplyDeleteIf your mother owned 1/3 of the title, and her entire 1/3 was transferred to you, then you should own 1/3. There is no automatic reason why you would only get half of what you thought you were getting. Not having seen the title, I can't say for sure what you own, but check it and see whether it says "an undivided one-third interest", as it should. If it says you only own one-sixth, then you had better look back to the Transfer of Land that your mother signed. If the transfer says "one third" then there is an error in the title that needs to be corrected. However, it's possible that the transfer document was incorrect and nobody noticed. Did you have any of it checked over by a lawyer before you went ahead?
ReplyDeleteLynne
I established a family trust in which myself, my wife, my son and my daughter are beneficiaries. While my wife is also a trustee, the trust is structured so that I have sole discretion on how any proceeds are dispersed and of the trust itself. I am purchasing a vacation property, and the accepted offer names myself, my wife, and the family trust as the buyers. It will be paid for 100% through a low interest loan that I only need to make payments on the interest for an indefinite term. My idea was to have the family trust as the owner of the property, but because the family trust has to "die" and its affairs wrapped up every 21 years, I was thinking that a Joint Tenancy with the trust and myself and possibly my wife named as joint tenants, might be a good idea. This may be a screwball idea, but instead of having to diperse any capital gains when the trust is wrapped up at 21 years, could the trusts interests simply pass to myself and my wife as the survivors - avoiding a capital gains disposition that would have to occur if the trust only owned the property?
ReplyDeleteMy husband and I were joint tenants. After separation (no formal agreement) my husband "sold" me his half of the house, releasing the title to me, and used that money to build another home, which he designated as not being a family residence. My name is not on a title. We are still married. If we reconcile and live together in a new home, does my name have to be added to the title in order to have a share in a property? Can I later claim a share without being added to the title?
ReplyDeleteI own a property as tenants in common with an ex husband that is registered as 50% each. We purchased before marriage, had an uncontested divorce over 7 years ago. We never resided together in any home so technically there was never a matrimonial home. He abandoned the property and marriage within the first month and has never paid taxes, heat, hydro, insurance or maintenance on this property. We have owned it approx 8 years and for the last 6 I have resided in it. It was initially purchased for us to live in and sell on retirement but as stated above we never got that far. I would like to sell this property now and he has agreed. How are monies divided when this property is sold ? I am content to share the proceeds upon sale 50/50. Does it matter who contributed what when it was originally purchased ?
ReplyDeleteI live in a home registered as tenants in common 50% each with another party. I keep home insurance on this property and someone broke their leg on the property and is now sueing me. Is the other owner 50% liable or am I 100% liable ?
ReplyDeleteWe have a family cottage that we all used growing up. At some point my widowed mother made my 2 sisters, my brother and I joint tenants of this property, My relationship with my brother has always been contentious and over time my one sister and her partner have been using this property as their own private resort. My mother has continued to pay all bills and taxes associated with the property with my sister doing upkeep. I stopped going due to my sister continueing to treat me as a guest on her property. Fast forward to my mom now in a nursing home with failing health now sending me and my other sister emails requesting that we file quit claims to allow my sister and brother to be sole joint owners of the property. I now have grandchildren and do not live far from this property so am very reluctant to give up interest in this beautiful property. Any advice?
ReplyDeleteI have a house the mortgage is 100% in my name but he is on title,it is tenants in common.He has passed away about 8 months ago and now the estate wants me to buy them out.I am not prepared to do that at this time can the force me to sell or is there a time frame that i can wait before buying them out.Origanal we bought this for a investment property.Thanks
ReplyDeletemy huband and his mom have a house to gether thay are joint tenents and his mom have past away know his brother and sister want him to sell the house dose he have to
ReplyDeleteAfter getting married for almost 3 years, husband and wife put down payment together to purchased a house, but the title of the house is only under the wife's name. What will happen if the husband or wife pass away during marriage? What will happen if they get divorced?
ReplyDeleteHi Lynne,
ReplyDeletePlease advise. 1.My father died many years ago, and Mom has been remarried for 22 years now. They are tenants in common on their home. If our step-dad passes away does my mom than have to pay pobate fees on their home. 2. My sister and Mom have a joint account at the bank. Should my Mom be diagnosed with dementia and be required to go into as assissted living home, would the gov't use this money to pay for her care? Even though my sister and Mom are jointly on the bank account? Thanks for any and all advise, Jeanette
Hi Jeannette,
DeleteYes, if a tenant-in-common passes away, title to the house is governed by the will. This means that it must be included in the inventory of the estate, and therefore included in the cost of probate. However, your mom doesn't pay the probate fees; the estate itself pays them from estate assets. As for your sister and Mom having a joint account, I can only say that this is usually a disaster waiting to happen. It's never clear whether the funds are truly jointly owned when they are inter-generational like that, so without some proper documentation there is a good chance that there is going to be a court application of some kind to clarify ownership after your Mom passes away. Whether or not the funds will be used to pay for her care will depend on the question of ownership or right of survivorship, but also on provincial rules. The rules are not the same from province to province.
Lynne
Hi Lynne:
ReplyDeleteI am a Certified Financial Planner, and have a client that has a cashable GIC through TD Canada Trust, that is registered jointly with her husband as "Joint without right of survivorship". In 35 years in the financial business, I have never seen "without" in a registration before. What does it mean?